|
Table of Contents
SW 9-16-03
James_Hernon__8-26-05
SW 9-16-03
Hi,
Just was reading your web page about brainwashing.
I think many religionists (as you call them) are in fact brainwashed. I agree this
type of brainwashing is indeed child abuse.
But I don't think that is the only thing that is
going on. You say
"In a five minute discussion between an Atheist and a religionist, what
chance do logic and reasoning have going up against years and years of
intense daily brainwashing?"
I don't think that logic and reasoning have much
to do with anybody's religious beliefs, or lack of them, including yours and
mine. I think there are powerful psychological reasons why people believe what
they do, even the ones who were not brainwashed in the way you describe on
your page.
There is the love factor. Moonies "love
bomb" people into starting up with them; if you go to one of their
meetings everyone smiles at you and looks soulfully into your eyes and is very
warm and you have never been so loved in your whole life and you might as well
give up all resistance right now. (THEN they start the more classic
brainwashing.)
There is the power factor. There is a Creator of
the Universe. He is angry and going to roast people. And I'm on His side. So
that makes ME powerful, better, judgmental, holier, whatever. That makes me
Powerful, whether I admit it to myself or not.
There is the control thing. People knock
themselves out trying to control other people's behavior. And judging,
condemning, "converting", frightening, are all classic control
moves. "You must submit to external authority of the
book/church/ministers! Under no conditions are you to trust anything that is
inside yourself! Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!"
And on and on. People believe what it makes them
feel good to believe. (Or powerful. Or in control.) Even people who do not
believe in religion.
I think that most people's religious beliefs are a
reaction for or against their parents and their parents' beliefs.
I also think that calling one's self an atheist is
using the religious frame of reference to define part of one's identity. If
one was truly outside of the religious frame of reference, then it just
wouldn't matter. I'm not a Hindu, but no part of my self identity is bound up
with being an a-Hindu-ist. I just don't care about it.
Mark Smith here} Well,
maybe if Christians would learn to mind their own business and stop trying
to take over the entire world, the task I'm doing wouldn't be needed. But
when you've got Christians making the newspaper almost daily with blowing up
buildings, shooting people for Jesus, drowning their babies because god told
them to, and trying to shove their religion down the throats of others on
public land, yes, I do think I'll stand up and say something. Sorry you
don't seem to care about these things that yes, indeed "matter".
I also think that psychology is replacing
religion, or has already replaced it in an important sense, as the prime
explanation of the internal world of human life. Many people have had more
intense growth experiences in some kind of therapy or with some
personal-growth book/event than in any church.
But that doesn't explain the persistence and
growth of these fundamentalist churches, does it? Not just in Christianity but
in Islam as well. I don't know the answer to that. And I agree with you, they
are dangerous.
Anyway, I like your page. Thanks for putting it
up.
Mark Smith here} You're
welcome, and we still agree on more than we disagree on. Bottom line is that
people shouldn't be brainwashing poor little kids. I would get just as upset
if Atheists were plotting to do this as religionists.
SW
James Hernon 8-26-05
Subject: Brainwashing is not just a Christian phenomena
Date: 8/26/2005 5:37:24 A.M. Pacific Standard Time
From:
Reply To:
To: JCnot4me@aol.com
Dear JCnot4me@aol.com,
I read your website articles and realise the tactics your informing people of
are in fact TRUE, many times I felt the emotional tactics used but alas
this is not only a christian sect
mentality, and when I looked closely at other (exclusivist religions) I
found the us and them mentality, the superior and inferior mentality.
Mark Smith here} You
are correct, this is not limited to Christianity, which is why I subtitled
my essay "CHRISTIAN Brainwashing", to distinguish it from Communist
Brainwashing, Buddhist Brainwashing, and any other kind that might be out
there.
Its not just a Christian phenomena but
is something that is part of all groupings and can be seen not only in religions
but also in any group/s… please look at politics, sectarian attitudes,
race, creed, social class, monetary status and even further down to colour of
hair and eyes see fascism.
Mark Smith here} I
strongly disagree. By saying that ALL groups have this, that ANY groups have
this, you have just defined "it" out of existence. And having been in or
visited plenty of groups over the years, I know from personal experience
that not ALL groups practice this. I noticed you presented no evidence to
back up your claim.
Anyway I think you should be more broadminded about your site concerning
brainwashing, its possible that all people become the victim of some sort of
perceptory deceit at some time.
If you have some kind of (only
Christians brainwash) then you leave yourself open to the criticism that your
anti-christian, the message is true, but people are always trying to
persuade others, this is sometimes due to what Christ himself said (If you be
not gatherers with me, then you scatter), the same kind of anti-group hatred can
lead to persecution as the Jews will tell you straitly.
Mark Smith here} I
don't want to shock you, and I hope you are sitting down for this. Ready?
This IS an ANTI-Christian web site. I don't take being anti-Christian
an insult. Given this, why would an anti-Christian web site want to spend
10,000 web pages writing about non anti-Christian topics???
What happens when the oppressed become the oppressors, they are blind to their
actions as they only remember the oppression they experienced.
Brain washing happens to individuals whose power is based upon the human need to
be loved and for acceptance, as you may know acceptance is something that most
human beings need and want from others in society and respect, acceptance and
approval is what most children long for from their peers. When someone is
admired by the youth the leader wields the power and this can lead to self
deception by the youth, the attitude is “our leader can do no wrong”, later
people realise the humanity and flaws of such leaders.
A belief in GOD is not something I force upon you or anyone else. But I know
your pain, from the crusades that you mention, whereby first you are made to
feel worthless, then useless, then grateful. I feel that you have animosity
about those days from your youth, not all the Christians you will meet have the
same kind of mentality towards others who live in different faiths or beliefs. I
myself had to fight against this us and them mentality that I felt was being
imposed by fundamentalists, but if you open your eyes a little bit you will
realise that Jesus spoke out against
those same ideas that the Pharisees and the Saducees had about their own
exclusivism.
Mark Smith here} But
Jesus is also the one that called non-Jews one of the biggest racist insults
of his day- he called them dogs. And if you've been following the current
Bush war in Iraq, you know the feelings of the middle east towards dogs. So
please, don't get too mushy on Jesus. He wasn't the saint you might be
imagining him to be.
Anyway I hope your having a good time, take it from me… this is not just a
Christian phenomena.
Thanks for the website.
James Hernon
|